Speaker A: 00:00:55

Welcome to the Kingdom Crossroads podcast with Pastor Bob Thibodeau.

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Pastor Bob conducts personal interviews with Christian influencers from around the globe, helping Christian authors, recording artists, CEOs, entrepreneurs, nonprofit leaders, and yes, pastors and ministry leaders to get the word out about what they are doing to impact the world with the gospel.

Speaker A: 00:01:19

Our podcast has been rated in the top 1/2% of all podcasts in the world by ListenNotes.com so you know your message will be heard.

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Now here is your host with today's interview, Pastor Bob Thibodeau.

Speaker B: 00:01:35

Hello, everyone everywhere.

Speaker B: 00:01:36

Pastor Bob Thibodeau here.

Speaker B: 00:01:37

Welcome to the Kingdom Crossroads podcast.

Speaker B: 00:01:39

Today.

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We're so blessed you're joining us.

Speaker B: 00:01:42

What if I told you that some of the most beloved superheroes of all time, characters that millions of people look up to, are actually promoting a twisted hidden agenda that behind the colorful images and the black blockbuster films, there is a deliberate effort to rewrite God's role in the universe.

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We all love a good hero story, good versus evil and light overcoming darkness.

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But what if the stories that are shaping our culture today are actually doing the opposite thing?

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What if your favorite comic book characters are subtly reshaping what we believe about God, about Satan, and about salvation itself?

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Today, Pastor Joe Schimmel is here to pull back the curtain and reveal what's hiding in plain sight.

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And once you hear this, you will never look at superheroes the same way again.

Speaker B: 00:02:37

Amen.

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Pastor Joe Schimmel is a renowned Christian pastor, speaker, filmmaker dedicated to exposing the hidden spiritual agendas in pop culture.

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As a founder of Good Fight Ministries, he has spent decades uncovering how music and movies and comics shape worldviews, often in ways that just basically distort biblical truth.

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His groundbreaking documentaries include they Sold Their Souls for Rock and roll, Marvel and DC's War on God series.

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And they've reach reached thousands audiences all across the world.

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I mean, today he joins us in revealing some shocking insights into the spiritual deception lurking behind some of the biggest names in entertainment.

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With that being said, help me welcome to the program Pastor Joe Schill.

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Pastor Joe, it's a blessing to have you back with us today.

Speaker B: 00:03:24

I always look forward to catching up with you, you know, and Doug stable in whenever we get a chance.

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You guys are doing some great work out there.

Speaker C: 00:03:31

Well, Pastor Bob, it's always a incredible joy for me to be on with you.

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I love your infectious spirit for the truth and your love for Jesus and it's one of the reasons I love being on your show.

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You love truth and, and you have no fear.

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I Praise God for that.

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Yeah, we're excited.

Speaker C: 00:03:46

We just got done with our new video, Stan Lee, God and the Devil.

Speaker C: 00:03:51

And I mean, he made 60 cameo appearances, you know, in the Marvel movies.

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And Marvel's the biggest movie franchise on earth.

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So it's influencing not millions, but hundreds of millions of people.

Speaker C: 00:04:04

So getting into Stan Lee and exposing what he's about was very, very important to us.

Speaker C: 00:04:10

The second, this is the third installment in our series and they're all eye popping.

Speaker C: 00:04:14

You know, in fact, the last one, we spent some time on Stan Lee and his character Dr.

Speaker C: 00:04:19

Strange.

Speaker C: 00:04:20

And Dr.

Speaker C: 00:04:20

Strange has made his appearance on the silver screen more than once now.

Speaker C: 00:04:24

And we show how Dr.

Speaker C: 00:04:26

Strange was basically made in the image of Satanist Aleister Crowley.

Speaker C: 00:04:30

And he talked about bringing the sorcerer back.

Speaker C: 00:04:32

Dr.

Speaker C: 00:04:33

Strange.

Speaker C: 00:04:33

And he helped develop Dr.

Speaker C: 00:04:34

Strange.

Speaker C: 00:04:35

That would be Stan Lee.

Speaker C: 00:04:36

And we show conclusive evidence.

Speaker C: 00:04:39

Even a gentleman named, well, Engelbert, he was one of the main workers on Stan Lee after he was developed by, I'm sorry, one of the main workers on Dr.

Speaker C: 00:04:51

Strange after he was developed by Stan Lee and Steve Ditko.

Speaker C: 00:04:56

And he talks about how he learned the magic and he becomes a member of Crowley's oto and himself got involved in that Satanism and imported that into Dr.

Speaker C: 00:05:07

Strange's character.

Speaker C: 00:05:08

We even show with Dr.

Speaker C: 00:05:09

Strange used to be called Dr.

Speaker C: 00:05:10

Droom.

Speaker C: 00:05:11

Yeah, that was before Druid.

Speaker C: 00:05:13

You know, same kind of connections where he actually looks the same, you know, as Aleister Crowley.

Speaker C: 00:05:18

Then they changed his look.

Speaker C: 00:05:19

It's, it's just mind boggling.

Speaker C: 00:05:20

We show like 20 different parallels.

Speaker C: 00:05:21

It's obvious, it's a slam dunk.

Speaker C: 00:05:23

But this new movie, we, we dive into Stanley himself.

Speaker B: 00:05:28

Okay.

Speaker D: 00:05:29

All right.

Speaker B: 00:05:30

You know, many comic book writers, you know, including those Marvel and dc, they have acknowledged connections to mysticism and occult practices and like alluded to as Alistair Crowley's teachings.

Speaker B: 00:05:46

How does this connection run?

Speaker B: 00:05:48

And what, you know, what evidences have you uncovered that suggest these creators are really just channeling more than just their creative inspirations?

Speaker C: 00:05:59

Yeah, it's a great question.

Speaker C: 00:06:01

You know, there's a popular, it's the most popular website promoting comics on the Internet.

Speaker C: 00:06:06

It's called Comic Book Review.

Speaker C: 00:06:08

And they have a poll done every four years for the top hundred writers.

Speaker C: 00:06:13

And the last four years before this, last New year, now we're talking about, you know, just over a year ago now, the top two guys were Alan Moore and then number two was Grant Morrison.

Speaker C: 00:06:24

Then this, just before this New year vote was for the next four years and Alan Morris.

Speaker C: 00:06:30

Alan Moore was Number one again.

Speaker C: 00:06:32

And Grant Morrison is number two.

Speaker C: 00:06:34

And this time Stan Lee is number three.

Speaker C: 00:06:37

Well, I've just talked about Stan Lee and his promotion of Lester Crowley's magic and so forth through, you know, Dr.

Speaker E: 00:06:45

Strange.

Speaker C: 00:06:46

And you know, the eye in the triangle was Dr.

Speaker C: 00:06:49

Strange's deal with that came from Crowley.

Speaker C: 00:06:50

All these different connections, it's crazy.

Speaker C: 00:06:53

But you look at the top two guys.

Speaker C: 00:06:55

Alan Moore, number one.

Speaker C: 00:06:56

I mean he's considered the Shakespeare of the graphic novel.

Speaker C: 00:07:00

And we show where he is agnostic.

Speaker C: 00:07:02

He talks about how he contacts demons, how he practices Crowley's magic.

Speaker C: 00:07:07

He calls, he says he's in touch with the demon of cinema.

Speaker C: 00:07:10

And he says as long as you treat them good, they'll treat you good.

Speaker C: 00:07:13

He's learned to work with them.

Speaker C: 00:07:14

And he channels a lot of the information from demonic entities.

Speaker C: 00:07:18

And then number two is Grant Morrison.

Speaker C: 00:07:21

And Grant Morrison, we have a clip in one of our videos where we show him coming on the stage and you know, a bunch of young people are just screaming their braces off.

Speaker C: 00:07:30

And not just young people, all ages really.

Speaker C: 00:07:32

And because he's considered just such an icon of the movement, he's the number two guy.

Speaker C: 00:07:37

And he talks about how he, you know, couldn't write.

Speaker C: 00:07:42

Alan Moore couldn't write really either until they got started practicing Crowley's magic.

Speaker C: 00:07:46

The Bible says, the book of Revelation, that the judgments of God's wrath come upon people because they of their worship.

Speaker C: 00:07:51

They refuse to repent of their worship of demons and stuff.

Speaker C: 00:07:53

We're seeing more of that in the end of days.

Speaker C: 00:07:55

And he talks about how he encourages these young people.

Speaker C: 00:08:00

There's a big giant, you know, he's big old, you know, he's speaking to this huge theater type thing and all these kids, young people there.

Speaker C: 00:08:07

And a big screening back has a big picture of Satan, Celeste Crowley with 666 under it.

Speaker C: 00:08:12

And he talks about, hey.

Speaker C: 00:08:13

He says, hey man, get into Crowley, buy Crowley's books.

Speaker C: 00:08:17

He encourages these young people.

Speaker C: 00:08:18

So these guys are spreading, they're saying hey, this is how I got, he talked about this is how I got my ability.

Speaker C: 00:08:23

So Satanism is spreading through the top writers that are advancing a lot of their teachings toward young people.

Speaker C: 00:08:29

In fact, one of his best friends who was a TV presenter for, in Great Britain for many years, he says of, of, of Grant Morrison, he goes, yeah, he, he shoots these Kenny coated bullets into the brains of kids.

Speaker C: 00:08:44

And when they get in he goes, they blank and mess them up.

Speaker E: 00:08:47

And.

Speaker C: 00:08:48

But he's saying this with glee.

Speaker C: 00:08:49

So parents need to be aware that they're.

Speaker C: 00:08:52

We're not against flesh and blood.

Speaker C: 00:08:53

There's a spiritual war, and they're after our kids.

Speaker B: 00:08:56

And you've provided us a couple clips that we want to listen to.

Speaker B: 00:08:59

You know, go ahead and explain the first one.

Speaker B: 00:09:01

What are we going to hear?

Speaker C: 00:09:02

Yeah, we've got three clips from the new movie.

Speaker C: 00:09:06

We do show some of the strange connection with.

Speaker C: 00:09:09

With Stan Lee.

Speaker C: 00:09:11

But the documentary starts off with him, you know, proclaiming he wants.

Speaker C: 00:09:16

Wanted to be God and so forth.

Speaker C: 00:09:17

And then it's interesting because that plays into him diminishing of God, diminishing God himself and exalting comic book characters.

Speaker C: 00:09:25

And basically he enters into biblical cosmology and considers God basically, you know, throws shade at God and exalts the devil in his work.

Speaker C: 00:09:36

And the first clip that would be great to see is of his sidekick, guy by the name of Ditko.

Speaker C: 00:09:46

And this gentleman we show in this clip where from his youth he.

Speaker C: 00:09:51

A bunch of Hasidic rabbis were jumping around him trying to cast, because his parents called him, because they were seeing what they thought was demonic activity in demonic manifestations in his life through him being severely sick and who knows what exactly they saw.

Speaker C: 00:10:04

And these guys were trying to cast this demon out of him.

Speaker C: 00:10:06

And he talks about how that experience changed his life and that it's from that time, by the way, that all these different characters and all this ability began to flow through Kirby.

Speaker C: 00:10:19

Now, it's interesting because we go from there to where he's asked to develop this character called Galactus by Stan Lee.

Speaker C: 00:10:29

And Galactus becomes a picture of God.

Speaker C: 00:10:31

And there's a new movie coming out just around the bend by Marvel on Galactus, which will probably be pretty huge.

Speaker C: 00:10:38

And Galactus is devourer of planets and.

Speaker C: 00:10:41

And destructive and, you know, just narcissistic into just feeding himself, even though if it means destroying planets and killing millions of people.

Speaker C: 00:10:49

And he says, and you'll see in this clip, you know, that he had to go to the Bible, you know, to develop his character and that he had to get away from because he realized he was dealing with God, you know, and then he goes on to see in this clip, but he also had to develop the Silver Surfer.

Speaker C: 00:11:03

And the Silver Surfer is Galactus's emissary, you know, his herald, who goes to these different planets, like a kind of John the Baptist kind of guy, to prepare them to be devoured.

Speaker C: 00:11:12

Yet the Silver Surfer has a change of heart.

Speaker C: 00:11:15

He realizes Galactus is basically incredibly destructive.

Speaker C: 00:11:19

And, you know, what he's doing is evil, and he Rebels against him to save humanity.

Speaker C: 00:11:26

And he says, as we'll see in this clip, that, that he was the fallen angel of the Bible, the devil.

Speaker C: 00:11:32

Yet he's the hero.

Speaker B: 00:11:34

Anyway.

Speaker B: 00:11:34

Let's roll a clip.

Speaker E: 00:11:35

But most people don't know is that the Galactus trilogy was a blasphemous and demonically inspired Gnostic tale which, like so many other Marvel stories, perverted God and exalted the devil.

Speaker E: 00:11:46

In: 1966

Speaker E: 00:11:54

And he threatened to destroy the Earth in yet another Armageddon like scenario like the Avengers Endgame with superheroes protecting the Earth from Christ.

Speaker E: 00:12:03

In the caricature Thanos, Silver Surfer turns against the God figure Galactus and joins the forces of the Fantastic Four to stop Galactus.

Speaker E: 00:12:11

In: 1966

Speaker E: 00:12:21

Lee stated to the Fantastic Four, quote, have them fight God.

Speaker E: 00:12:25

And what was Jack Kirby's response?

Speaker E: 00:12:27

He declared, quote, I went to the Bible and I came up with Galactus.

Speaker F: 00:12:31

My stories are people's stories and there's elements in my stories that are very, very real.

Speaker F: 00:12:37

And it doesn't matter what the subject is.

Speaker F: 00:12:39

And of course I, for some reason I, I went to the Bible, I came up with Galactus.

Speaker F: 00:12:46

And there I was in front of this tremendous figure who I knew very well because I've always felt him.

Speaker F: 00:12:57

And I certainly couldn't treat him in the same way that I would any ordinary mortal.

Speaker F: 00:13:04

And I remember in my first story, I had to back away from him to resolve that story.

Speaker E: 00:13:10

Stanley and Jack Kirby then set out to portray God as an evil entity who destroys worlds to satisfy his insatiable appetite to fear feet on the life bearing planets.

Speaker E: 00:13:20

Jack Kirby, who created Galactus with Stan Lee and introduced the Silver Surfer, rendered God as estranged from humanity much in the way that Lee did.

Speaker E: 00:13:28

While Kirby is reported to have rarely displayed much of his art in his home, it is interesting that Kirby did display at least three depictions of God in his home, which are quite revealing.

Speaker E: 00:13:36

The first of the three pictures by Kirby appears to be an allusion to the book of Revelation with God's angels bearing trumpets, which the book of Revelation announced the judgments and woes on the wickedness of unrepentant humanity in chapters 8 through 11.

Speaker E: 00:13:49

The second depiction reveals God to have his back turned on humanity, which appears as a malignant mass of chaos and Perversion.

Speaker E: 00:13:56

The third depiction has God turned away from humanity, with humans depicted as both pleading and retaliating against God, with some even picking up rocks to throw at him.

Speaker E: 00:14:05

For Kirby, this all seems a bit personal, as he stated when he made Galactus by going to the Bible and that he had to back up from him a bit because he knew he was dealing with someone far more than mortal.

Speaker E: 00:14:16

Since Lee and Kirby made sure that God was depicted as the evil Galactus, gobbling up planet after planet in his quest to quench his insatiable appetite for power, who would be the superhero that humanity and even the Fantastic Four would rely upon as their savior from God?

Speaker E: 00:14:30

m the Lord God said in Isaiah: 14:12

Speaker E: 00:14:38

In the King James version, son of the dawn, you have been cast down to the earth.

Speaker E: 00:14:42

Jack Kirby makes it clear that the Silver Surfer was Satan, the fallen angel.

Speaker F: 00:14:46

And of course, the Silver Surfer is the fallen angel.

Speaker F: 00:14:49

And when Galactus relegated him to Earth, he stayed on Earth.

Speaker F: 00:14:55

And that was the beginning of his adventures.

Speaker F: 00:14:58

And they were figures that had never before been used in comics.

Speaker F: 00:15:03

They were above mythic figures.

Speaker F: 00:15:07

And of course, they were the first gods.

Speaker F: 00:15:13

And I began thinking along those lines and the new gods evolved from those lines.

Speaker F: 00:15:20

And I began to ask myself, everybody else had their gods.

Speaker F: 00:15:25

What are ours?

Speaker G: 00:15:26

The server has never been huge.

Speaker G: 00:15:29

He's been more of a cult character, you know, within that universe.

Speaker G: 00:15:32

Certain people receive, respond.

Speaker G: 00:15:33

So he was a fascinating character to begin with because in the beginning he was sort of completely cold and learning about humanity.

Speaker G: 00:15:40

And then he makes this phenomenal sacrifice.

Speaker G: 00:15:42

He sacrifices everything, all this power, the entire universe to help these people.

Speaker G: 00:15:47

You know, so he becomes a fallen angel.

Speaker G: 00:15:49

You know, this is the guy who had Stan Soapbox on the bullpen page.

Speaker G: 00:15:52

So here it was.

Speaker G: 00:15:52

And the first issues were at double sized, 44 page stories.

Speaker G: 00:15:55

So it was a 44 page Stan soapbox.

Speaker G: 00:15:58

Essentially.

Speaker G: 00:15:59

You know, he got to like talk about whatever was on his mind.

Speaker E: 00:16:01

While Lee would portray many humans and demons and even Satan, as good and as superheroes in his comics, God would become the devil.

Speaker E: 00:16:09

In fact, as we shall clearly see, the character that Stan Lee used to depict, his favorite version of the devil in Marvel, would become his personal mouthpiece to spout his anti God Gnostic views when answering the question as to who really is his favorite superhero.

Speaker E: 00:16:23

In his foreword to Marvel's Masterwork, Silver Surfer, Volume 1, after discussing Spider man and his other creations, Lee declared, quote, and yet, if Push comes to shove and I really have to name the one that turns me on the most.

Speaker E: 00:16:36

Well, I think you've guessed it by now.

Speaker E: 00:16:38

It just has to be that high flying, parable, spouting cosmic powered, shiny dome spanner of the Starry Spaceways, arguably the most unique and certainly the most soliloquizing superhero of them all.

Speaker E: 00:16:49

The Silver Surfer.

Speaker D: 00:16:50

This character looked so heroic and so noble and so dramatic that I gave him the name the Silver Surfer.

Speaker D: 00:17:00

And instead of just a guy flying around finding planets, I made him a philosophical observer of the world and the universe.

Speaker D: 00:17:10

And I had him talk in semi Shakespearean and biblical language.

Speaker E: 00:17:16

And.

Speaker D: 00:17:18

He became my mouthpiece for how I feel about a lot of things.

Speaker D: 00:17:22

I, I told Jack I want to use this character.

Speaker E: 00:17:25

Lee was so guarded about ensuring that his favorite superhero would remain his philosophical mouthpiece that for a long time he forbade anyone else to write the Silver Surfer.

Speaker D: 00:17:34

I didn't want anybody to write the Surfer but me.

Speaker D: 00:17:37

And for a long time I was the only guy who put the words in Norrin Radd's mouth.

Speaker D: 00:17:43

I liked the way Jack drew him because he looked so heroic and so noble.

Speaker D: 00:17:50

More than heroic.

Speaker D: 00:17:51

There was a nobility to him.

Speaker D: 00:17:53

And then I decided I want to use him in a lot of stories.

Speaker D: 00:17:57

And what I want to do is have him really be my voice.

Speaker D: 00:18:03

I want him to say all the things that maybe I've been thinking of for years.

Speaker H: 00:18:08

I was a kid when the Silver Surfer first appeared.

Speaker H: 00:18:11

He was an incredible character, a noble creature himself.

Speaker H: 00:18:15

He was working for, you know, a very hungry giant who was going to do in Earth.

Speaker H: 00:18:22

It was an incredible story.

Speaker H: 00:18:23

I always found Galactus and the Silver Surfer's relationship really kind of strange.

Speaker H: 00:18:29

Here was this rather honorable and downright noble creature floating around in space on this surfboard and looking terrific.

Speaker H: 00:18:39

But what he was basically doing was bringing the devil and destruction to wherever he.

Speaker H: 00:18:46

He was an immediate hit.

Speaker H: 00:18:47

Everybody just loved his character.

Speaker E: 00:18:49

Just as the all loving God who gave himself on the cross to save the world is twisted into an evil being.

Speaker E: 00:18:54

Satan as Stan, Lee's mouthpiece in the form of the Silver Surfer is turned into a benevolent being like God.

Speaker E: 00:19:00

Later, his origin story we tweaked from Galactus creation and fallen angel to Norn Rad, an alien who rebelled against the service of Galactus after vowing to serve him for sparing his own planet.

Speaker E: 00:19:11

Of course, for Lee and Kirby who created Silver Surfer, it would be years before Kirby would admit that the Silver Surfer had always been Satan, the fallen angel from the Bible.

Speaker E: 00:19:20

This is quite Chilling.

Speaker E: 00:19:21

When Stan Lee has stated repeatedly that the Silver Surfer is not only his favorite comic character, but served as his own philosophical mouthpiece, one has to ask the question, why does Jack Kirby not only admit that he had to back away from Galactus because he knew him after twisting him into a planet, devouring God and portraying him as evil, and then turn around and make Satan the one who he admits is the fallen angel of the Bible, into the Silver Surfer, the superhero.

Speaker E: 00:19:45

The answer to this question goes back to his childhood and an encounter Kirby apparently had with demonic powers.

Speaker E: 00:19:51

He stated from that time onward, he came to believe demonic entities were very real and that the encounter had opened up his mind to them and had influenced his work ever since.

Speaker E: 00:20:00

When Kirby was nine years old, his parents witnessed what they believed to be demonic possession.

Speaker E: 00:20:05

They believed that demonic entities had seized control of his body and were manifesting while Kirby was weak and ill with pneumonia.

Speaker E: 00:20:12

They summoned rabbis who came to the same conclusion.

Speaker E: 00:20:14

In the words of biographer Ray Wyman in his book the Art of Jack Kirby.

Speaker E: 00:20:18

After stating that Kirby's life was filled with the mysticism of faith, he states, quote, all afternoon the rabbis worked, demanding unseen spirits to release their deadly grip on young Jack's soul.

Speaker E: 00:20:30

According to Kirby, the rabbis gathered around his bed and chanted, a Hebrew demon, come out of this boy.

Speaker F: 00:20:36

Demons were real.

Speaker F: 00:20:38

I'm lying there on a bed, I'm a 9 year old boy and 10 rabbis are dancing around my bed.

Speaker D: 00:20:47

Not a good sign.

Speaker F: 00:20:48

And they're all saying, come out of this boy demon.

Speaker F: 00:20:53

What's your name, demon?

Speaker F: 00:20:56

Don't hurt this boy demon.

Speaker F: 00:20:58

The devil has been here with us a long, long time.

Speaker F: 00:21:01

In fact, as long as the angels.

Speaker E: 00:21:03

And God, whatever one wants to make of this encounter, Kirby claimed that it was a major influence on his writing later.

Speaker E: 00:21:10

Indeed, no one in comics did more to influence countless youth into the occult worldview and made the demonic realm more acceptable and accessible in the counterculture revolution than Jack Kirby.

Speaker E: 00:21:20

While the Silver Surfer became Stan Lee's satanic mouthpiece, it seems that Jack Kirby became a mouthpiece for Legion Legends of Demons.

Speaker E: 00:21:27

Author and Kirby fan Jeff Olson states that he believes Kirby's illness and exorcism experience was his shamanic initiation which cracked open his creative unconscious like an egg and allowed a bottomless pantheon of superheroes, super villains, sidekicks, monsters and freaks to flow freely from his pencil.

Speaker E: 00:21:44

Olsen goes on to state that his quote, four decade output has become Hollywood's version of blood diamonds, from which he states, the majority of comic to film superheroes, Iron Man, Thor, Captain America, the Fantastic Four, X Men, the Hulk, and Spider man originally sprang.

Speaker E: 00:22:01

While Kirby got physically better after the attempted exorcism, he became only sicker and more twisted spiritually as he became a channel for the demonic powers that would later use him to blaspheme the creator in the form of Galactus and glorify Satan through the Silver Surfer.

Speaker E: 00:22:15

Kirby's work would be the catalyst that would introduce millions of impressional youth to both old and new demon gods.

Speaker E: 00:22:21

After the demonic experience that he admitted had a huge influence on his writing career, he went to DC Comics, where he created superheroes like the Demon, where an etragon, the demon, is the son of Belial, a term used in the Bible meaning worthless, which later became personified as Satan in both Judaism and Christianity.

Speaker B: 00:22:37

Wow.

Speaker D: 00:22:38

Wow.

Speaker B: 00:22:39

So this is talking about just warping the minds of.

Speaker B: 00:22:47

And they start with a youth, because what's going to have the youth are going to grow up and have their own kids, you know?

Speaker B: 00:22:51

Yeah, yeah.

Speaker B: 00:22:53

So it just spreads and populates.

Speaker B: 00:22:55

I mean, how.

Speaker B: 00:22:57

How can we not see this?

Speaker B: 00:23:02

You know, why is that so blinding to everyone?

Speaker B: 00:23:05

Because, you know, they flock to these movies by the millions.

Speaker C: 00:23:10

Yeah, yeah.

Speaker C: 00:23:10

It's amazing.

Speaker C: 00:23:11

And, you know, later on, you know, they'll change his origin story, but make him norn rad and so forth.

Speaker C: 00:23:18

That would be the Silver Surfer.

Speaker C: 00:23:19

But his original origin story as a good guy was Devil.

Speaker C: 00:23:23

And what's fascinating about this and Heart Sickening at the same time is we show, you know, Stan Lee saying that the Silver Surfer was his philosophical mouthpiece, the one who represents Satan, the devil.

Speaker C: 00:23:36

And so that sets us up really for the next clip, Bob, because in the next clip, we see a story that was written by Stan Lee himself, and it's called God Woke.

Speaker C: 00:23:49

And what's interesting about this is that he turned this into a film.

Speaker C: 00:23:55

This meant more to him than any other comic.

Speaker C: 00:23:57

And because he's showing forth his philosophy.

Speaker C: 00:24:01

And in this, you actually hear Stan Lee narrating the story of God Woke.

Speaker C: 00:24:06

His voice back when he did this on stage before a bunch of people one time they threw things at him because they realized it was blasphemous toward God.

Speaker C: 00:24:13

Well, guess what?

Speaker C: 00:24:15

People are at a place where they wouldn't throw anything nowadays.

Speaker C: 00:24:17

They'll just mock God right along with you sometimes.

Speaker C: 00:24:19

And so people will see that he basically shows God as being indifferent because he believed in God.

Speaker C: 00:24:26

So some say, oh, he's an atheist.

Speaker C: 00:24:27

We show here, and from an interview, we show that he had had, or we referred to with A guy that ate lunch with him all the time, a good friend, he goes, oh, he believed in God.

Speaker C: 00:24:35

He just believed that God was not perfect.

Speaker C: 00:24:38

And here we show that God Woke.

Speaker C: 00:24:40

God basically finds out that he's the reason for all the problems because he doesn't really care about humanity.

Speaker B: 00:24:46

Let's run that clip.

Speaker E: 00:24:48

Lee's twisted view of God that he shared repeatedly with Jim McLaughlin over lunches for two decades was blasphemously portrayed in his poem God Woke, which has been called these, quote, most personal, revealing work where Lee bears his soul.

Speaker D: 00:25:02

You know, I've spent most of my life writing about superheroes.

Speaker D: 00:25:07

Well, one day about, oh, 30 years ago, I decided to write about the greatest hero of all.

Speaker D: 00:25:14

And I wanted to do it in a different way.

Speaker E: 00:25:17

publicly at Carnegie hall in: 1972

Speaker E: 00:25:27

pen arms, admitted as late as: 2017

Speaker E: 00:25:42

That's the reason for God Woke.

Speaker E: 00:25:44

In God Woke, Lee depicts God as a befuddled, half remembering, flawed creator who is ultimately responsible for all the evil atrocities committed by human beings.

Speaker E: 00:25:53

McLaughlin admitted that he worked with Lee to expose, quote, a large audience to the poem, which was then adapted by Deadpool creator Fabian Niciesa and a team of artists and animators into animation.

Speaker E: 00:26:05

McLaughlin stated, quote, We've been looking for a way to bring this to a large audience for a while now, and the recording in Stan's own voice is the best possible vehicle to do just that.

Speaker E: 00:26:15

In God Woke, Lee depicts God, like the fallen humanity that he created, as less than righteous, less than just, less.

Speaker D: 00:26:23

Than righteous, less than just.

Speaker E: 00:26:26

Lee depicts God as an old senile being who only half remembers the past and who, after awakening, after eons, is discouraged to find that humanity has made a mess of his pristine creation and then would dare waste their breath uttering noisy prayers to him as he regards them as nothing more than a mere anthill.

Speaker D: 00:26:43

Who else but a fool with a cosmos to savor would be bound just to earth granting boon, granting favor.

Speaker D: 00:26:53

Who else but a fool with a cosmos unfolding would linger with man ever praising and scolding?

Speaker D: 00:27:03

Who else but a fool with a cosmos to stray in Would conceive him an anthill?

Speaker D: 00:27:12

And like a prisoner Sleep, stay in.

Speaker D: 00:27:16

Who else but a fool would create mortal men and then be expected to tend them?

Speaker E: 00:27:24

Lee doesn't quite appear to grasp the inherent contradiction of a sophomore philosophy that on one hand, he regards God to be a fool if he actually cared about his creation on earth enough to intervene in the affairs of humans made in his image.

Speaker E: 00:27:37

And on the other hand, as we shall see, he condemns God for supposedly not caring more to save humanity from their plight.

Speaker E: 00:27:43

The truth is that Jesus revealed that the Heavenly Father cares even for one of the smallest birds and states that he cares for his children far more.

Speaker E: 00:27:51

Jesus declared to his followers, quote, are not two sparrows sold for a penny, yet not one of them will fall to the ground outside of your Father's care.

Speaker E: 00:27:59

And even the very hairs on your head are all numbered.

Speaker E: 00:28:02

So don't be afraid, you're worth more than many sparrows.

Speaker E: 00:28:05

In Lee's poem, God Woke, God awakens irritated by the quote, man sounds everywhere.

Speaker E: 00:28:11

But he especially despises being bugged by humans and quote, the haunting, hollow sound of prayer.

Speaker E: 00:28:16

Lee depicts God as mocking human prayers by only answering them with laughter.

Speaker D: 00:28:21

He heard the man sounds everywhere, the shots, the clangs, the roars, the bangs, the clatter, clamor, guns and hammer.

Speaker D: 00:28:31

And then he found, to his despair, the haunting, hollow sound of prayer.

Speaker D: 00:28:41

A billion bodies ever bending, a billion voices never ending.

Speaker D: 00:28:48

Give me, get me, grant me, let me, love me, Free me, hear me, see me.

Speaker D: 00:28:54

While he pondered, watched and waited.

Speaker D: 00:28:58

Endlessly they supplicated, chanting, ranting, moaning, groaning, sighing, crying, cheating, lying.

Speaker D: 00:29:08

But towards what goal?

Speaker D: 00:29:10

What grand direction, this pious tide of genuflection?

Speaker D: 00:29:16

To please their Lord, to please their God.

Speaker D: 00:29:21

He raised his head and laughed, laughed hard.

Speaker E: 00:29:25

Contrary to Lee's law lie, it is Satan and the evil powers of darkness that hate our prayers.

Speaker E: 00:29:30

God actually invites us to pray.

Speaker E: 00:29:32

Jesus declared, quote, ask and it will be given to you.

Speaker E: 00:29:35

Seek and you will find.

Speaker E: 00:29:37

Knock and the door will be open to you.

Speaker E: 00:29:39

Lee wrongly portrays God as callous and even offended at humanity's prayers for help.

Speaker E: 00:29:43

Because after all, in Lee's view, God just created us for his entertainment only for him to become disillusioned and bored with humanity.

Speaker D: 00:29:49

And then I gave them paradise, the fertile, verdant earth.

Speaker D: 00:29:56

At first I found the plan was sound and somewhat entertaining.

Speaker D: 00:30:01

But once begun, the deed now done, my interest started waning.

Speaker D: 00:30:07

The seed thus sown, the twig now grown, I left them there alone.

Speaker E: 00:30:13

Lee then depicts seeking God in prayer as foolishness.

Speaker E: 00:30:16

Not only because God is supposedly an uncaring being, but Also, because all human ills and wars are are the result of people seeking God in prayer.

Speaker D: 00:30:23

Only man earnestly praying to his God as he's slaying, and piously saying as the corpses increase.

Speaker D: 00:30:34

He does what he must, for his motives are just the mayhem, the carnage, the slaughter won't cease.

Speaker D: 00:30:43

But no need to worry, God's in his corner.

Speaker D: 00:30:47

He's killing for peace.

Speaker D: 00:30:50

Man, Man's greed, man's hate, man's crime, man's war.

Speaker D: 00:30:59

The Lord our God could bear no more.

Speaker E: 00:31:04

In the last stanza, Lee presents the thesis behind God woke.

Speaker E: 00:31:08

Lee in his mind forces God to take a hard look in the mirror, to confront the one who Lee believes is really behind the evil in the world.

Speaker E: 00:31:15

He must ask the question, is it God or man?

Speaker D: 00:31:18

He looked his last at man so small, so lately risen, but so soon to fall.

Speaker D: 00:31:28

He looked his last and had to know whose fault this anguish, this mortal woe had man failed.

Speaker D: 00:31:39

Maker or maker man.

Speaker E: 00:31:42

Well, according to Stan Lee, after a long sleep and a hard look in the mirror, God finally comes to the realization that he's the one to blame for all evil after all, according to Lee, he's the bumbling demiurge of Gnosticism who came up the whole plan anyway.

Speaker D: 00:31:56

Who was the planner and who's the plan?

Speaker D: 00:32:01

He looked his last, then turned aside.

Speaker D: 00:32:07

He knew the answer and then God cried.

Speaker B: 00:32:14

So what kind of message do you think this is given to, you know, not just the young generation, but their parents that are taking them to see these movies and stuff?

Speaker B: 00:32:25

Hey, folks, Pastor Bob here.

Speaker B: 00:32:26

What a time for today's portion of this great interview.

Speaker B: 00:32:28

Pastor Joe Schimmel.

Speaker B: 00:32:30

To find out the answer to that question, you gotta come back for part two.

Speaker B: 00:32:34

Amen.

Speaker B: 00:32:35

We're all out of time for today.

Speaker B: 00:32:37

Oh, man.

Speaker B: 00:32:38

Pastor Joe and his team at Good Fight Ministries, they are doing a terrific work in exposing the lies of the devil.

Speaker B: 00:32:46

And it just invades pop culture.

Speaker B: 00:32:48

I mean, it is.

Speaker B: 00:32:49

I first was first introduced to Joe Schemmel way back, gosh, 20 years ago, I guess, through his video about the and they saw their souls for rock and roll.

Speaker B: 00:32:59

And I'm gonna put links to all this down below in the show notes.

Speaker B: 00:33:01

Go down, click the links, watch the videos and come back for part two and we'll continue this great interview.

Speaker B: 00:33:07

Till then, it's Pastor Bob Romanian.

Speaker B: 00:33:08

Be blessed in all that you do.

Speaker A: 00:33:12

Thank you for listening to today's episode of the Kingdom Crossroads podcast.

Speaker A: 00:33:17

Please subscribe to our podcast so you can be notified when another episode is published.

Speaker A: 00:33:22

interviews and: 1000

Speaker A: 00:33:26

Pastor Bob is known as a podcasting expert for helping others to create their own podcast to share their messages with the world.

Speaker A: 00:33:34

Please visit our website@www.podcastersforchrist.com.

Speaker A: 00:33:41

that web address again is www.podcastersforchrist.Com.

Speaker A: 00:33:47

for more information, until next time, be blessed in all that you do.